"My Difficult Decision" [9/24/06]

Discuss the latest videos from Bree, Daniel, and others!

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Nora Volkova
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Post by Nora Volkova »

NillaWafers wrote:What bugs me is that even thought her parents say she shouldn't be able to participate in the ceremony, she is going ahead with the preparation anyways?

Two things you can do with this -- I'm sure there are other possible solutions as well:

a) Bree's parents don't make the decisions regarding that ceremony. They aren't clergy, in whatever form that takes in their religion.

b) This one is actually compatible with A -- Bree's parents telling her that they don't think she "should be able" to participate is parental-speak for "We're very disappointed in you for breaking our rules." Their view of the purity bond *as it applies to their own daughter* might encompass more than the official view of the purity bond. Maybe they have personal hopes that she will become some sort of clergy eventually.

I had a friend in high school who was raised Catholic. I remember him telling me that he had cheated on a test in school when he was a boy, and he got caught and punished for it. He served as an altar boy and really enjoyed that role. His parents were so upset with him for his cheating that they told him that they really thought he shouldn't have the privilege of service, but they sent him to confession. He continued as an altar boy, and he said that everyone's disappointment upset him much more than getting a failing grade on the test. He never cheated again.
Last edited by Nora Volkova on Sun Sep 24, 2006 10:50 pm, edited 2 times in total.
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curriguy
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Post by curriguy »

Way2Curious wrote:
edited to add: oh yeah and I'm not a dude! :D
sorry ma'am :oops:
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Way2Curious
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Post by Way2Curious »

I never even thought that them saying that she should not be able to be in the ceremony, really meant that she wasn't going to be. I am thinking that that was her parents way of showing disapointment in her, as well.
I heard things like that growing up too (don't we all?).
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Way2Curious
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Post by Way2Curious »

curriguy wrote:
Way2Curious wrote:
edited to add: oh yeah and I'm not a dude! :D
sorry ma'am :oops:
LOL...not a problem at all, I don't exactly use a gender specific name!
:)
BreeSmells
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Post by BreeSmells »

If you go on to link her religion with "purity bond" you find countless mentions of lonelygirl's purity bond to her father. Many religions, one such as Christianity, idealy would like to keep their followers pure/chaste and would rather have them focus on the meaningful bond (agape) to God rather than to one another (eros). But let's be honest, how many people disregard that and find love in any ways (including just kissing) and at any age they possibly can and all this with a religion that preaches us to keep certain urges away mostly because of original sin - free will is seen as an enemy.
Thelema on the other hand is vastly different (besides not being monotheistic) when all it does is preach free will : "Love is the law, love under will", and the statement "Every man and every woman is a star". Thus find your true will and do it under the constraints of the law, whose nature is love.
Thelema is even Greek for "the will"
What I'm poorly trying to get at it is: I think Bree's dad is the one unecessarily always putting her in this situation when all in all, her religion + Daniel really can go together, if it is her choice, if she finds her own path. Just like that former video title "me, religion, and daniel"



Oh yeah and no virgin/purity needed in the following of Thelema:
http://www.reference.com/browse/wiki/Thelema


Ethics
Thelema stresses individual liberty balanced by responsibility and discipline, the inherent divinity of every person, regardless of gender , and the battle against superstition and tyranny. Ultimately, the interpretation of Thelema and The Book of the Law is left to the individual; for this reason, aggressive attempts at conversion are strongly frowned upon, although using personal example to promulgate the Law is encouraged .

Crowley wrote two documents to codify his concept of Thelemic ethics: Oz and Duty.
Liber Oz

Liber Oz establishes the rights of the individual. For each person, these include the right to: live by one's own law; live in the way that one wills to do; work, play, and rest as one will; die when and how one will; eat and drink what one will; live where one will; move about as one will; think, speak, write, dress, love, paint, carve (etc.) as one will; and kill those who would thwart these rights. The rights established in Oz are often considered to be complimented by the obligations given in Duty.
Duty

Duty is described as "A note on the chief rules of practical conduct to be observed by those who accept the Law of Thelema." There are four sections:

1. Duty to Self: essentially describes the self as the center of the universe, with a call to learn about one's inner nature. Further, every Thelemite is to develop every faculty in a balanced way, establish one's autonomy, and to learn and do one's True Will.
2. Duty to Others: A Thelemite is called to eliminate the illusion of separateness between oneself and all others, to fight when necessary, to avoid interfering with the Wills of others, to enlighten others when needed, and to recognize the divine nature of all other beings. Further, it is noble to relieve the suffering of others, but pity (seen as condescending) should be avoided.
3. Duty to Mankind: Thelemites should try to establish the Law of Thelema as the sole basis of conduct. Further, the laws of the land should have the aim of securing the greatest liberty for all individuals. Crime is viewed from the point of view of violating one's True Will ("Thus, murder restricts his right to live; robbery, his right to enjoy the fruits of his labour; coining, his right to the guarantee of the state that he shall barter in security; etc.").


I mean, I guess there might be some purity requirement before a ceremony of some kind but I just can't find anything like that let alone make sense of it with Thelema of all faiths.
As cliche as it is, daddy there is looking more and more like the antagonist over Daniel, atleast to me.

...?
trombonegds
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Purity Bond.

Post by trombonegds »

I do not think that Daniel and Bree had sex. Not everything is about sex.

I think breaking the purity bond was by kissing Daniel and/or lying to her parents and sneaking out. (She might not have told them about kissing Daniel)
lonelygirl
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Post by lonelygirl »

lordgreystoke422 wrote:
missthemystery wrote:OK. I DO NOT think this is what's going to happen, but it seems the creators really want us to believe this ceremony involves a virgin sacrfice.

The mystery of her religion is really good. Yes, I'm sure she's occultist. Funny though. Because a purity bond sounds very evangelical Christian (as does homeschooling).

No...Purity is very important within Thelemic rituals I am sure and does not just involve sex. Also...I am certain Bree is planned to make a blood sacrifice of some sort... Hence the reason she is engaged in blood doping(not proven but likely what the bandages and the iron pills or for..i.e Erythropoietin shots.). That however suggests that she is expected to survive this blood sacrifice....it's a measure to insure that upon said blood loss she doesn't flat pass out and not finish the ceremony. I'd say based on my readings of Crowley in the last week it very well will also involve some sex majick.
can you elaborate on what you've been reading and your theory? it sounds interesting.

people start watching the videos on revver to support them so they can make some money. i would feel bad if they put so much work into these videos and didn't really get paid much for them b/c they're really entertaining and interesting.
BreeSmells
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Post by BreeSmells »

If you're referring to me, my post only stressed love and I never did highlight the idea that she and Daniel had sex. But in religions, there usually lies two forms of love, a spiritual type like agape in Catholicism or a sexual type like eros. Now when two people start kissing/dating/sort-of-dating you can kind of assume by nature that it will somehow at some time lead to eros...
I'm sure when Bree was talking about swapping saliva a couple of videos back she wouldn't have been so humorous about it and shy rather more confused and distraught knowing she had broken a purity bond...
Surely some pertinent info is missing from all this.
Jeet_DM
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Post by Jeet_DM »

What I am unsure of is that she was told by her parent that she shouldnt be allowed to do the ceremony, but she is still prepareing for it. So her parents will maybe lie to the order and not say "she violated her purity bond" so she can continue?
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lordgreystoke422
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Post by lordgreystoke422 »

lonelygirl wrote:
lordgreystoke422 wrote:
missthemystery wrote:OK. I DO NOT think this is what's going to happen, but it seems the creators really want us to believe this ceremony involves a virgin sacrfice.

The mystery of her religion is really good. Yes, I'm sure she's occultist. Funny though. Because a purity bond sounds very evangelical Christian (as does homeschooling).

No...Purity is very important within Thelemic rituals I am sure and does not just involve sex. Also...I am certain Bree is planned to make a blood sacrifice of some sort... Hence the reason she is engaged in blood doping(not proven but likely what the bandages and the iron pills or for..i.e Erythropoietin shots.). That however suggests that she is expected to survive this blood sacrifice....it's a measure to insure that upon said blood loss she doesn't flat pass out and not finish the ceremony. I'd say based on my readings of Crowley in the last week it very well will also involve some sex majick.
can you elaborate on what you've been reading and your theory? it sounds interesting.

people start watching the videos on revver to support them so they can make some money. i would feel bad if they put so much work into these videos and didn't really get paid much for them b/c they're really entertaining and interesting.
Oh geez..ummm NO I can't elaborate on what I have been reading..my head exploded yesterday and I am still cleaning up the mess...but generally read the basics..wikipedia on thelema and crowley..Ummm gosh..I've read so many...but this was my general take based on the weeklong experience. I recall having read some basics of the best candidates for sacrifice..of which blood of an innocent male child makes the best(didn't say ALL of it)...and goes on from there...I cant recall that site..but should be basics of thelema. Then Bree being a virgin...and crowley being VERY into sex majick...it just follows..then..against that..she is still a minor..so..but her parents aren't allowed to go...and her dads a top dog it seems...awwww crap.... **BABOOM**..there went my friggin head again..
My Latest videos:

Call to Arms...Or Would That Be Feet? #54
http://one.revver.com/watch/156886/flv/affiliate/28541

There is No Ice Cream in the Champagne Room at the Ceremony #55
http://one.revver.com/watch/166473/flv/affiliate/28541

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Truth-in-Science
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Post by Truth-in-Science »

anyone figure why that this video is not on UTube yet???
Or is it just me? If so, that's a shame.
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samanthe
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Post by samanthe »

What a depressing video. :|
thevictim
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Post by thevictim »

Truth-in-Science wrote:anyone figure why that this video is not on UTube yet???
Or is it just me? If so, that's a shame.
it is loaded at ebay now since 1:06 am. PST. monday the 25th

what is a 16 yearold doing up this late on a homeschool night? :)
paleodan
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Post by paleodan »

The video is on YouTube now and the random tag is "bastirma," which after a cursory search online, looks to be a kind of dried beef--the origin of pastrami.

On another topic, I find it very strange how strict her parents are. If Bree's religion is supposed to be Thelema, they really aren't very good at following the Law. Thelema is anti-authoritarian and all about individual will.
Mortal Wombat
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Post by Mortal Wombat »

Does anyone else think it's kind of weak that when Daniel asks her to choose between their relationship and her religion, the reason she comes up with is that she's only known him for 2 years, versus her being religious her whole life?

Bree has shown herself to be quite the intelligent and thoughtful girl in the past. This whole deal with Daniel and teenage rebellion has presumably made her examine why her religion is important to her.

You'd think she would give us a better reason than "this is the way it's always been", which is an answer for those too stupid or timid to examine themselves and their beliefs. It's a kids answer, not that of someone who has come to terms with their faith in a mature or critical manner.

Maybe I'm being harsh on her because I rejected the religion of my birth in my teenage years, and want her to do the same, but I don't think The Creators are giving the character the depth they'd so carefully built up over previous months.
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