Why don't you stick up for yourself???

[Esteed]

I am calm. I just think you're blind to the fact that Jonas was being a dick. I'm fine with that, but what pissed me off at the time is that you then come in acting all high and mighty and making all these ridiculous statements about Sarah and Taylor. That pissed me off.

Right now? I couldn't care less. I've accepted that we're probably never going to see eye to eye on this issue. You'll continue to think Jonas did nothing wrong, and I'll continue to think his actions were pathetic and unfair. You'll continue to defend Jonas to the hilt and I'll continue to defend Sarah and Taylor to the hilt. That's just the way it is.

[New voice of reason]

Hi Esteed,

I guess you didn`t mean me by saying that Jonas could do nothing wrong; I mean, I critised him as well for getting close to Bree in such a situation as she was..

But you must also understand that Jonas was a loner for a long time - which means we is really longing for love and affection, just as Daniel is because of his broken home. And in a way, he was also pushing it too hard, just as Daniel is doing it with Sarah.

Nevertheless, I like the chars, even if I see that they sometimes make mistakes. After all, don`t we do that all sometimes?

And for that compliment:

Such positive comments always make me blush. Even in real life. Nevertheless, thank you.

Yours
New Voice of reason

[Esteed]

I was referring to sack, sorry.

[suze900]

[edited to remove stuff that shouldn't have been there]

[thoughtssopoetic]

I care for Daniel and Jonas ... they both care deeply for Bree.

And they care for you, too.

i hope so

nope. they hate you. they're only carting you around until the opportune moment to cut you up and offer you as a sacrifice. obviously not a virginal sacrifice but a sacrifice none the less.

I think I'm going to start a new organization called the S.P.C.F.C.--"The Society for the Prevention of Cruelty to Fictional Characters".

Motto: "sshh! they can HEAR you!"

can i join?

[Susan]

I am calm. I just think you're blind to the fact that Jonas was being a dick. I'm fine with that, but what pissed me off at the time is that you then come in acting all high and mighty and making all these ridiculous statements about Sarah and Taylor. That pissed me off.

Right now? I couldn't care less. I've accepted that we're probably never going to see eye to eye on this issue. You'll continue to think Jonas did nothing wrong, and I'll continue to think his actions were pathetic and unfair. You'll continue to defend Jonas to the hilt and I'll continue to defend Sarah and Taylor to the hilt. That's just the way it is.

This is what I mean when I ask you to calm down. If you note, I've made no derogatory statements about you. I have kept my discussion to the events and the people in them. In any debate, when the debaters get to the point of attacking the opponent instead of the issue, they have lost perspective and loose the debate--Speech 101.

[LesterG]

I'm sorry too. I was not blind to the fact that Jonas took them to task. I sure was blind to Captain Emo as you call him. All I saw was a private transmission from a hurt man to the people who hurt him. It was Sarah and Tayor who splattered it all over the internet and made it into such a big issue. May I also point out that Jonas was blind sided; Sarah was not.

Also, please calm down. Let's not start a war over this.

if anything get your facts straight, Taylor let out the letter that Jonas WANTED to have seen otherwise he wouldn't have copied it over to all the parties involved... if he did not want it to be seen he would have sent it to Taylor and Taylor only... seeing as how Jonas copied and Blind copied to Daniel basically shows how Jonas wanted his vented feeling to be shown it does not get anymore clearer then that..

and another note, he asked for it.. you don't email someone you just met, bad things about her sister no matter how badly they insult their own sister... they're blood... they can do that to each other.. but you must realize that when you insult someone else's family, you are the outsider and therefore you are insulting her family...

He got what he asked for and they've gotten past all that. You can't accuse Taylor and Sarah of splattering it over the internet, that's what's going to happen when you do brash things like that. Jonas was acting like a spoiled brat not getting his way and he got a big reality check. do you really think Taylor would sit back and allow her family to be insulted?

They are passed this though, Jonas is not yelling at them for putting it on the internet. He knows how he was acting. He said it himself in his video about his dad died.

Here's the thing. I'm not gonna be mopey anymore. I'm not gonna wallow in my own self-pity. I'm making myself sick, you know. I'm annoying myself.

He acknowledged the way he was acting. So can we put this hatred against Taylor and Sarah away? They only reacted to his action.

so put in layman's terms he started it and got what he deserved.

edit: that should make more sense

[hockeygurl]

Being all angry at them and holding old stuff against each other seems kind of a waste since in this last vlog Jonas seems at peace and comfortable with his friendship with Taylor. Probably a relief for him to be far from the uncomfortable D/S dynamics back home? Sure, Taylor kicked his ass in the vlog about his letter, but she did it in a way that maybe made him laugh a little too. At least he knows where he stands with her. I think she's been a good friend to him.

[Susan]

I think, Lester, you would have done better to quote my previous post. The one you quoted had nothing to do with the subject discussed.

For those of you who are confused, I have been defending an accusation made that I only take Jonas' side and do it unreasonably against all the others. The accusation was made by Esteed several pages ago. I have pointed out that my defense of Jonas in other situations has been as much against his actions (waving the gun) as for them (sleeping with Bree). Our discussion has not been about the Taylor debacle except where it illustrated the other incident.

I am not at this time willing to discuss yet another area where my opinion did not match yours. We all see these issues in a different light. That we have differing opinions is good. It allows for lively discussion. Esteed has agreed that s/his opinion and mine will remain different. Kindly allow the subject to drop.

[chershaytoute]

:chershaytoute steps in, suited up in housekeeping outfit:



I would like to remind everyone in this thread of several things.

Posts need to be made in such a way that they address the characters AS the characters...and don't refer to them as CHARACTERS.

Folks need to remember that good old golden rule about doing unto others, especially as it has to do with the Forum Etiquette, Rules, and Policies:

Be Friendly
This is the number one rule at this forum. We want this to be a friendly, happy place for people to discuss LG15 and all the fan fiction based on it. Insulting people or other mean comments have no place at this board. Before posting a message, take a moment and reflect whether yours the sort of comment you would make to one of your close friends. For example, if you notice someone has misspelled a word or made a mistake in their grammar, instead of posting a message in the thread pointing this out and perhaps embarrassing them, it is much more friendly to send them a PM to let them know.

Be Friendly
This is the number one rule at this forum. We want this to be a friendly, happy place for people to discuss LG15 and all the fan fiction based on it. Insulting people or other mean comments have no place at this board. Before posting a message, take a moment and reflect whether yours the sort of comment you would make to one of your close friends. For example, if you notice someone has misspelled a word or made a mistake in their grammar, instead of posting a message in the thread pointing this out and perhaps embarrassing them, it is much more friendly to send them a PM to let them know.

Swearing
We understand that the debates at this board are likely to get heated and on occasion an explicit may slip into your language. Heck, even the Internet’s sweet heart, Bree, has been known to swear on the rare occasion. But excessive or unnecessary swear will not be acceptable on this board. Use of swear words or any other derogatory comments to insult anyone is never acceptable, and all posts containing them will be deleted regardless of the rest of their content.

Disagreements: Attack the Argument, Not the Poster
With so many different theories being tossed about it is to be expected that people will start to debate with each other. We would just like to make sure everyone understands that it is fine to attack someone’s argument, to try and figure out where they are wrong, but it is never acceptable to attack, or insult the poster themselves. For example, “You’re stupid, your point is dumb” is not what we would like to see on this board, we would greatly prefer to see posts like “I disagree with your point because…”

I may or may not be wandering through this thread later to clean up the relatively off topic postings (Jonas related) later - so anything you don't want to get sucked up into the vacuum cleaner, please grab hold of! I tend to get a wee bit...uh...zealous! <rueful grin>

Thanks!

[New voice of reason]

Hi Sarah,

don`t be too disappointed with yourself because you screw it up now with that paper of Gilman.

I know how I feel when I did something wrong because of being clumsy. It almost starts to make me feel depressed.

The thing is: You can`t change it anymore. So, try to make the best out of it. Maybe, you could try to contact Spencer again and tell him to watch the vid and tell him what happened.

So, then, your clumsiness would be useful for something, if he reacts...

Anyway, I feel sorry for you. Try to cheer up, now that most of the people are putting hate-mails about you here. Sometimes, just stupid things happen.

Yours
New Voice of reason