Ive given up on bree

exanimatebylove · Post by **exanimatebylove** » Tue Jul 10, 2007 2:15 am

I will never give up on Bree.

For the longest time Bree was kinda, eh, whatever to me. I mean, I liked her but, no biggie. I would have cared less if she was in the vids or not. Now that she's gone however, I miss her sooo much.

I don't give up easily. I mean, she could have gone through the ceremony, be preggo with an order baby...I dunno ANY situation...and I'd still somehow believe she'd find her way back to them. That's just me. I never give up. Never ever. Period.

nowherepixie · Post by **nowherepixie** » Tue Jul 10, 2007 7:16 am

Oooh eeerrrr.

BlackCatonMars · Post by **BlackCatonMars** » Tue Jul 10, 2007 1:16 pm

I just know that if it were me I could never give up on my friend, especially if I thought that he/she weren't in his/her right mind or acting of their own free will. Even more so if I thought he/she could be hurt or killed. If I just went back to my own life I would never stop feeling guilty knowing that I could've tried to help, maybe even done something to save my friend, and that I gave up and abandoned them to their fate.

Also, while college and a job and so on are good things they are 1) not for everybody and 2) working against an evil operation such as the Order can be exciting and lend a sense of purpose to life. Maybe TAAG is relying on Jonas's money, but they're doing so in order (no pun intended) to save Bree and to take down a bad organization (although I admit they haven't done much to dismantle the Order yet, but hey that takes time).

New voice of reason · Post by **New voice of reason** » Wed Jul 11, 2007 2:20 am

Hi!

Well, maybe, if we knew where she was, we could send Bree some "Cadbury`s black magic" pralines. I am absolutely sure that this will take away the whole brain-washing... No one can resist Candbury`s black magic;-)... (This is my favourite chocolate, although I cannot get it in my country, I always have to go to the UK when I want it... Grr..)

Anyway, our problem is: We don`t know where she is.

I mean, the creators are in a bad situation at the moment: Jessica L. Rose is occupied (the actress that plays Bree) and they have to find some other action to go on. I already made some suggestions for fillers - but I don`t know whether the creators are interessted in that..

I mean they say that they read our stuff here (thank you for that, Creators), but they have also their own idea how to continue the series.

I guess as soon as Jessica is a little freer, we will get more of Bree again. I just hope so...

And meanwhile, we don`t give up on Bree unless she wants us to, o.k.? (I mean, at least I won`t)

Yours
New Voice of reason

blade8r · Post by **blade8r** » Wed Jul 11, 2007 6:09 am

okay i already know that jessica herself is busy with other endevors and is very occupied. im not trying to imply about quiting the lg15 universe. i was talking about leaving bree with the order. im too hooked on lg15 to quit.. are you crazy?

since a new video is up i like to add it my take, this new video "hope he's not mad" is first video that has happen to show all of the main characters togeather except for bree in one video. daniel talked about how his life is nothing. jonas yearns for a normal life. sarah hasn't really been trying but we can truely see how fed up she is. taylor is new to the game so you can see how she's fairly optomistic. everyone has experiance some kind of stress level.

did you see spencer's face and reaction when the group talked with him? i get the feeling he's a scardy cat. you know the kind of guy who'll quit on ya when it's too unconfertable or dangerous. i mean im only speculating about spencer but i get this eerie feeling about him. but it's probably because i mostly dont like his hair. anyways

we'll like i was saying earler if a friend of yours has a problem that IS life changing and can be life threathening. would you help them out?

- Yes of course, it's my friend i will help.

well then how you going to convince a friend, who whole heartedly belives in her religion to stop worshiping all togeather? remember not to forget that she did grow up with this religion and has been only avoiding her duties as a lowly acolyte.

i belive she won't change as she has been brainwashed since birth. she won't give up her religion because it gives her comfort & she feels safe. She even believes in Salvation through her faith as she belives her song gives her peace.

i know this because i am an atheist.

i have many close friends who are religous. i once was a faith go-er myself untill i decided to know more about theology. i came my atheist conclusion after i found historical evidences and differences in the scriptures. i learned how religion controls the mind and has you act like a crab in a bucket. where if one crab has the chance to escape there is the crab below will pull him back under.

i have tried... i mean i tried with many of my friends to convice them that the old religion is wrong even showing them the Facts and evidence based material. yet they choose to belive in the make belive. to them make-belive is more real then evidence.

i gave up. but knowing though that the religion my friends are in.. is not there to hurt them.. but is something that definatly has a mental control of their lives. they just choose to live in ignornace..

so i hope you can understand how i gave up. because i know bree is in a place where she is not unsafe. but now she openly choses to live her life in ignorance.

now i don't want to stir up a religion argument. i just wanted to make a point and let you see through my eye's of what the difficulties are as they are very similar to what the group has with bree. maybe you can put yourself in bree's position and be there in the spot if it were even possible that your best'est of friends convince you out of your religion.

as i already know im a minority among most people in the world. i know what i belive in so plz don't give me the, i will pray for your soul. i hope god see's forgivenesss in your. la da da di da da.. yeah.. plz none of that. im not trying to offend anyone. i just want you guys to open your eye's a bit.

rayne100 · Post by **rayne100** » Wed Jul 11, 2007 6:18 am

blade8r wrote:okay i already know that jessica herself is busy with other endevors and is very occupied. im not trying to imply about quiting the lg15 universe. i was talking about leaving bree with the order. im too hooked on lg15 to quit.. are you crazy?

since a new video is up i like to add it my take, this new video "hope he's not mad" is first video that has happen to show all of the main characters togeather except for bree in one video. daniel talked about how his life is nothing. jonas yearns for a normal life. sarah hasn't really been trying but we can truely see how fed up she is. taylor is new to the game so you can see how she's fairly optomistic. everyone has experiance some kind of stress level.

did you see spencer's face and reaction when the group talked with him? i get the feeling he's a scardy cat. you know the kind of guy who'll quit on ya when it's too unconfertable or dangerous. i mean im only speculating about spencer but i get this eerie feeling about him. but it's probably because i mostly dont like his hair. anyways

we'll like i was saying earler if a friend of yours has a problem that IS life changing and can be life threathening. would you help them out?

- Yes of course, it's my friend i will help.

well then how you going to convince a friend, who whole heartedly belives in her religion to stop worshiping all togeather? remember not to forget that she did grow up with this religion and has been only avoiding her duties as a lowly acolyte.

i belive she won't change as she has been brainwashed since birth. she won't give up her religion because it gives her comfort & she feels safe. She even believes in Salvation through her faith as she belives her song gives her peace.

i know this because i am an atheist.

i have many close friends who are religous. i once was a faith go-er myself untill i decided to know more about theology. i came my atheist conclusion after i found historical evidences and differences in the scriptures. i learned how religion controls the mind and has you act like a crab in a bucket. where if one crab has the chance to escape there is the crab below will pull him back under.

i have tried... i mean i tried with many of my friends to convice them that the old religion is wrong even showing them the Facts and evidence based material. yet they choose to belive in the make belive. to them make-belive is more real then evidence.

i gave up. but knowing though that the religion my friends are in.. is not there to hurt them.. but is something that definatly has a mental control of their lives. they just choose to live in ignornace..

so i hope you can understand how i gave up. because i know bree is in a place where she is not unsafe. but now she openly choses to live her life in ignorance.

now i don't want to stir up a religion argument. i just wanted to make a point and let you see through my eye's of what the difficulties are as they are very similar to what the group has with bree. as i already know im a minority among most people in the world. i know what i belive in so plz don't give me the, i will pray for your soul. i hope god see's forgivenesss in your. yeah.. plz none of that.

Your very condecending as well as angry, did you mean to come off that way?
I understand what you are saying about the brainwashing of Bree, however most religions are not like the Hym of one.
People do not choose to be ignorant by having a religion, they choose to believe the tennents of their religion. It makes them feel better to have something to believe in. It truly is their choice unlike what we have seen with HoO.

I hope that we see another video soon

blade8r · Post by **blade8r** » Wed Jul 11, 2007 6:41 am

rayne100 wrote: Your very condecending as well as angry, did you mean to come off that way?
I understand what you are saying about the brainwashing of Bree, however most religions are not like the Hym of one.
People do not choose to be ignorant by having a religion, they choose to believe the tennents of their religion. It makes them feel better to have something to believe in. It truly is their choice unlike what we have seen with HoO.

I hope that we see another video soon

no im not trying to be condecending or angry in any way. it's not the way im trying to portray myself twords religion. but for most atheist, all religion or any cult...it's the same thing. brainwashing or free will.. bree CHoose to get in the car with lucy. she Choose to leave jonas. She choose the HoO as it makes her feel better to have something to belive in.

wait.. i pretty much copied your post and put bree as the one who choose HoO.

Susan · Post by **Susan** » Wed Jul 11, 2007 1:24 pm

blade8r wrote:
rayne100 wrote: Your very condecending as well as angry, did you mean to come off that way?
I understand what you are saying about the brainwashing of Bree, however most religions are not like the Hym of one.
People do not choose to be ignorant by having a religion, they choose to believe the tennents of their religion. It makes them feel better to have something to believe in. It truly is their choice unlike what we have seen with HoO.

I hope that we see another video soon
no im not trying to be condecending or angry in any way. it's not the way im trying to portray myself twords religion. but for most atheist, all religion or any cult...it's the same thing.

You have the right, certainly, to believe whatever gives you the most satisfaction; but don't confuse Religion with Faith. Religion is organized belief. It has the sacred books and holy places. It requires a sameness of thought and usually has you congregate to reinforce that thought. Faith is not that at all. Faith is each person listening to their own heart and making the connections they feel are right. Often these connections follow the general outlines of one of the organized religions close enough for that person to be comfortable joining an organized religion.

If you find that your belief system--your faith--leads you to believe there is no God, fine. But if you choose your faith to disprove someone else's religion, you should probably do a bit more meditating on it.

rayne100 · Post by **rayne100** » Wed Jul 11, 2007 1:56 pm

Susan wrote:
blade8r wrote:
rayne100 wrote: Your very condecending as well as angry, did you mean to come off that way?
I understand what you are saying about the brainwashing of Bree, however most religions are not like the Hym of one.
People do not choose to be ignorant by having a religion, they choose to believe the tennents of their religion. It makes them feel better to have something to believe in. It truly is their choice unlike what we have seen with HoO.

I hope that we see another video soon
no im not trying to be condecending or angry in any way. it's not the way im trying to portray myself twords religion. but for most atheist, all religion or any cult...it's the same thing.
You have the right, certainly, to believe whatever gives you the most satisfaction; but don't confuse Religion with Faith. Religion is organized belief. It has the sacred books and holy places. It requires a sameness of thought and usually has you congregate to reinforce that thought. Faith is not that at all. Faith is each person listening to their own heart and making the connections they feel are right. Often these connections follow the general outlines of one of the organized religions close enough for that person to be comfortable joining an organized religion.

If you find that your belief system--your faith--leads you to believe there is no God, fine. But if you choose your faith to disprove someone else's religion, you should probably do a bit more meditating on it.

Thanks, that was exactly what I was trying to say, but you said it more eloquently.

blade8r · Post by **blade8r** » Wed Jul 11, 2007 8:12 pm

okay.. THIS ISNT ABOUT ME.. it's about giving up on bree.

Susan your are Absolutly Right. but i must contest that i am not confused about faith or religion.

as I am someone that dosnt want to live by faith alone

faith by definition means:
* To believe without reason or To trust impulsively, or believing based upon personal hopes
* belief that does not rest on logical proof or material evidence.
* A set of principles or beliefs.
* confidence or trust in a person

unfortionatly i need evidence to belive in something. i do not blindly belive in something that hasn't proven itself. also faith and religion are almost littearly the same thing. it's a simple concept really.

there can be faith without religion..but there cannot be religion without faith.. NOT GOING TO HAPPEN. without faith there is no religion.

as god in all respect is definatly an intagable idea. faith also mean to belive in the intagable, such as feelings and mood. this you were right about that susan. the problem is that with religion there HAS to be faith.. there is no such thing as a mutually exclussive religion that doesnt invlove faith.

do i know the difference? absolutly, i do make it an effort not to be uninformed.

but enough about that. arguement in religion will never end. it just comes to show how archaic mankind really is in today society.

i like to mention that since bree is prevalant in her religion and has Faith... what can the group possibly do about it?

i say give up!

BlackCatonMars · Post by **BlackCatonMars** » Thu Jul 12, 2007 2:37 am

I think the idea here is that Bree is not necessarily safe - she's not just hanging out with a religious group, she's actually being used by a very dangerous organization with questionable motives. Although Bree got into the car willingly we 1) Don't know how the conversation went and what may have been said to prompt Bree to get into the car and 2) she was also at the time bent on saving Jules so she may have felt she had to get into the car to help an innocent young girl.

Considering all that Bree has gone through and learned about the HoO it is unlikely that she's suddenly refound her faith, and considering her unstable behavior in the rented cabin it looks far more likely that she was under the influence of some sort of drug or drugs and/or was brainwashed and therefore not operating under her own free will. When she left the second time it is possible (and in my opinion extremely likely) that she was either still brainwashed (although she denied it...but who would admit to being brainwashed if they haven't been deprogrammed?) or was trying to sacrifice herself in order to get her friends to lead normal lives. In the case that she is still brainwashed then there is hope that they can still save her. If she has sacrificed herself, while that is noble of her, that doesn't mean her friends are likely to give up or should give up on her when she's faced with imminent harm. She may want the best for her friends but what's best for them spells trouble for her, and what friends that have gone through as much as TAAG have together would give up now?

New voice of reason · Post by **New voice of reason** » Thu Jul 12, 2007 4:19 am

Hi!

There is a difference between other religions and Bree`s HoO. Bree`s HoO has already made her taking drugs without allowing her to interfere (we remember the video where Bree, Dan and Jonas were put under drugs and where the strange voice occured).

Other religions, on the other hand, allow the people to develop a free will. If you can opt out without any problems or negative consequences, any kind of religion is o.k. But remember that Bree couldn`t: They were followed by the HoO.

Now, you who are an atheist: You don`t want missionaries who try to get you back on track and you don`t want any of the "I pray for your soul"-stuff. Fine. But don`t you think with your being missionary in the other field, i. e. trying to convince your friends that your atheism was right, you were doing the same thing the other way round?

With Bree, though, it is a different matter. Remember that she was already on her way out of the cult when her father was killed. And remember the HoO following her.

We have reasons that she is not actiing like she is because she is convinced her religion is right but that her free will is broken.

As long as we doubt her freedom in making decisions, Bree needs our help. And I believe the creators will give us no other clues.

Yours
New Voice of reason

blade8r · Post by **blade8r** » Thu Jul 12, 2007 5:33 am

BlackCatonMars you make an excelent point and it's something i like to futher talk about.

when it comes to brainwashing...

im an army reservest as well.. i remember my whole time in boot camp basic training. im sure many of you guys have been active duty or severd in the forces. anyways, before i left my friends and all they remembered me as how i was.. after the whole thing.. i when i came back. i was different.. i mean aside the whole hes' really fit, yada yada. mentally hes' changed... he's differnt. i don't get it.. did they brain wash you or something?

alot of my friends thought i got brainwashed.. well it's really hard to explain but your whole mental psyche is different. but it's not brainwash its really just an installment of values.. and a sense of pride... unless you actually done it yourself i really can't explain it.

i see it being no different. to what bree is experianceing. although i agree it's does seem like she's trying to escape the whole thing. and give her friends a normal life. but they are choosing not to.

in terms of free will.. everyone will always have a choice. the mind is strong but the honest truth about it is that it can be broken. she did look baligerant talking about HoO when the group stole her back from the HoO.

by the way all major religions or cults have some sorta of danger with them. like alot of jihadst of today. or back in the 1500's durring the time in rome is was againsted the law to speack againsted the bible or teach things againsted the church. anyone who broken a law was put to death.. actually now that i think about it. its the same saudia arabia. it's illegal to not be muslem.

btw there has been major discussion about two differnt factions in the order. there is the one who are following the group trying to get closer and trying to contact bree and convince her to go back. and there is also the a group who doesnt care how it is done but wants to use force to make bree do the ceramony. one that person who obvously kidnap the group in Vegas, who killed bree's dad and spencers dad. who later was killed off witha bullet when bree and daniel was running throught the desert. and the other part of the HoO who doesnt want to hurt bree. such as the watchers. they don't want to do anything bad to her. as far as i can tell. lucy is with the part that wants her to join and do the ceramony out of her own free will. I highly doubt she is under the influence of druggs but rather is just back on her iron pills and probably taking epogen again to ready her blood for... whatever they are reading her blood for.

if i remember correctly she has to do the ceramony out of her own free will. and a person brainwashed isn't free will per say. she can't do the ceramony under the influence of druggs or brainwashed it doesnt work like that.

voyboy · Post by **voyboy** » Thu Jul 12, 2007 11:39 am

Heres what I think.

The Ceremony is something more terrifying than what we have thought.
And I think that Bree will in fact end up doing it.
Whatever it is, it will change the world.
__________________________________________________

No matter which direction it goes. I do hope that once this Ceremony thing is out of the way, that the next main thing to accomplish will be to find Jonas's parents.

Man I want to see that scene when he finally finds them and there's a confrontation!!!

blade8r · Post by **blade8r** » Thu Jul 12, 2007 11:38 pm

voyboy wrote:Heres what I think.

The Ceremony is something more terrifying than what we have thought.
And I think that Bree will in fact end up doing it.
Whatever it is, it will change the world.
__________________________________________________

No matter which direction it goes. I do hope that once this Ceremony thing is out of the way, that the next main thing to accomplish will be to find Jonas's parents.

Man I want to see that scene when he finally finds them and there's a confrontation!!!

ummm so do you think the group should quit their endevors?