Lonelygirl15

watchingall wrote:I don't think there are any "secrets" to this, just a scholarly way of laying out good storytelling

HOWEVER, fantastic thread and possibly a way to keep an eye on the way things are going. Thank you for posting this!

I definietly don't think there are any secrets to this either- but it does help you guess what might happen next- or at least create wild and elaborate theories.

I think Daniel is going to go home and leave Bree with Jonas- he can't be "camping" forever, can he?

storyteller wrote:

watchingall wrote:I don't think there are any "secrets" to this, just a scholarly way of laying out good storytelling

HOWEVER, fantastic thread and possibly a way to keep an eye on the way things are going. Thank you for posting this!

I definietly don't think there are any secrets to this either- but it does help you guess what might happen next- or at least create wild and elaborate theories.

I think Daniel is going to go home and leave Bree with Jonas- he can't be "camping" forever, can he?

He definitely sounded extremely stressed and upset, I posted in Bree's forum that she really needs to do another nice thing for him and talk to him more than the stuffed animals.

I dont care for daniel that much, but I will be very sad if he leaves her alone and is out of the picture. Jonas + Bree = puke. I dont mean that in a sexual way cause if I want porn im not gonna get it from LG! Just... I dont like bringing him in and replacing Daniel as a storyline.

I think he's cute but thats about it :p

watchingall wrote:
He definitely sounded extremely stressed and upset, I posted in Bree's forum that she really needs to do another nice thing for him and talk to him more than the stuffed animals.

I dont care for daniel that much, but I will be very sad if he leaves her alone and is out of the picture. Jonas + Bree = puke. I dont mean that in a sexual way cause if I want porn im not gonna get it from LG! Just... I dont like bringing him in and replacing Daniel as a storyline.

I think he's cute but thats about it :p

HA! I'm w/ you one that- J+B= puke! Maybe I'll change that to my sig.

My thing with Daniel is that he's too good- he takes care of Bree to such an extent that he is (in some ways) self-distructing and Bree really isn't being altogether up front with him. I think there are a lot of things Bree knows that she isn't sharing.

If Bree and Daniel stay together Bree will never grow up- she will depend on Daniel to protect her and to make descisions- which he's obviously getting fed up with. I think Jonas is going to be a catalyst for change in Bree- he's going to challenge her choices and her immaturity and she will have to make a descision to oppose the order- not just do what her parents tell her or get Daniel to hide her.

From http://faculty.gvsu.edu/websterm/Hero.htm (Vladimir Propp)

Dramatis personae: (seven roles which any character may assume in the story)

1. the Villain, who struggles with the hero; The Order- may need a specific face to pin on... Jonas?
2. the Donor, who prepares and/or provides hero with magical agent;Jonas? more info here: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fairy_godmother
3. the Helper, who assists, rescues, solves and/or transfigures the hero; Daniel
4. the Princess, a sought-for person (and/or her father) who exists as goal and often recognizes and marries hero and/or punishes villain; bit more difficult since Bree is a girl, but I suspect it's a more mature version of Bree- plus her parents who have been kidnapped.
5. the Dispatcher, who sends the hero off;Bree's parents
6. the Hero, who departs on a search (seeker-hero), reacts to the donor and weds at end;Bree
7. the False Hero, who claims to be the hero, often seeking and reacting like a real hero. Gemma?

I had forgotten about Propp (there is way more to him than this) but I found this today while looking up some information on a folktale. I'm just throwing out a few suggestions...

Good theories, and I'm definitely beginning to re-think Jonas' role in this story. Thanks !

After this weekend, i decided that I had missed something and in the course of a little more research i found information about the Heroine's Journey. It's obviously different from the Heroes' Journey.

This information came from this page: http://www.glasswings.com.au/Storytroni ... ourney.htm

"Usually, through no fault of her own, the heroine must bear the burden of her parents' mistakes. She is then presented with humanly insurmountable challenges that require supernatural aid to overcome. Other women are almost always adversarial, except supernatural helpers. Her worth is usually defined by her beauty and patience. Her skills tend to be equally as decorative in value as herself. Her usual character flaw is curiosity. She is saved or experiences an upturn in fortune through marriage and the efforts of her lover."

Not sure about this last part- I don't see Bree Getting married- but I do think the other things mentioned here are interesting and applicable.

I'm looking for more information about the differences, but I may have to buy a few books...
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I can't believe I just found this topic. Big fan of the Hero's Journey.

Thought I'd add this, Archetypes in the Hero's Journey:
The Mentor
The Threshold Guardian
The Herald
The Shapeshifter
The Shadow
The Trickster

http://members.optusnet.com.au/~mgoodin19/archtype.htm

I've also seen the queen, hero partners/helpers, and the fool.

From: http://www.mythichero.com/what_is_mythology.htm

" The hero having crossed the threshold is swallowed into the unknown abyss, reborn in the new world, and may appear to those left behind as dead or lost. This may manifest as the hero is swallowed into the darkness and lands in the ‘Belly of the Whale.’ There he awaits rebirth or release from this purgatorial state. His release here symbolizes a relinquishing of attachment to the world left behind."

The part of terminator that Jonas talks about it the "Belly of the Whale" portion of that character's journey-

The idea is that she comes out, not necessarily ripped and ready to kill, but definetly changed.

Look for the action to come next.

EDIT:
Thought I'd add this link as well- very interesting. http://www.apocprod.com/Pages/Hero/Hero ... _whale.htm
Also, read SUPREME ORDEAL as the Ceremony, or some kind of confrontation with the order.

storyteller wrote:From: http://www.mythichero.com/what_is_mythology.htm

" The hero having crossed the threshold is swallowed into the unknown abyss, reborn in the new world, and may appear to those left behind as dead or lost. This may manifest as the hero is swallowed into the darkness and lands in the ‘Belly of the Whale.’ There he awaits rebirth or release from this purgatorial state. His release here symbolizes a relinquishing of attachment to the world left behind."

The part of terminator that Jonas talks about it the "Belly of the Whale" portion of that character's journey-

The idea is that she comes out, not necessarily ripped and ready to kill, but definetly changed.

whoa...interesting..thanks for posting!

i totally agree with this analysis. i pointed this out and added the minor point that both daniel and jonas were prophets

ericski wrote:i totally agree with this analysis. i pointed this out and added the minor point that both daniel and jonas were prophets

What I find ironic is that Daniel was the more dedicated prophet in the bible- dedicated to the point of facing death- while Jonah was not exactly an enthusiastic participant...

true, storyteller. he had trust issues.

The next few steps for Bree...

The Road of Trials

Once past the threshold, the hero encounters a dream landscape of ambiguous and fluid forms. The hero is challenged to survive a succession of obstacles and, in so doing, amplifies his consciousness. The hero is helped covertly by the supernatural helper or may discover a benign power supporting him in his passage.
Bree's first obstacle is to meet her father and talk to him- this is her first (?) obstacle.

[edit] Marriage

The ultimate trial is often represented as a marriage between the hero and a queenlike, or mother-like figure. This represents the hero's mastery of life (represented by the feminine) as well as the totality of what can be known. When the hero is female, this becomes a male figure.

Since I don't believe Bree will be marrying, I think it might be possible to see a relationship spark for her- most likely (let's hope!) her reunion with Daniel.

[edit] Woman as Temptress

His awareness expanded, the hero may fixate on the disunity between truth and his subjective outlook, inherently tainted by the flesh. This is often represented with revulsion or rejection of a female figure.
Perhaps a rejection of a more serious relationship with Daniel or a rejection of a relationship with Jonas.

[edit] Atonement with the Father

The hero reconciles the tyrant and mercifal aspects of the father-like authority figure to understand himself as well as this figure.
Bree is reunited with her parents? I have a hard time seeing this, since there is such a running theme of emancipated (semi-)minors in this story.

I have a feeling that she may see her father in a week (if you don't know what I'm talking about, see the video discussion for "Bree Phone Home" and pay attention to the phone number) but she won't be staying with them. She'll most likely go on staying with Jonas.

Hopefully this will give us some answers on the ceremony and why the Order has been trying not to get to the "D" in OpAphid...

EDIT:
A more detailed look at the coming stages to follow...

I think we are seeing Bree in the belly of the whale right now.